Are the Dragons stirring? [Archive] - The Unofficial Warcraft III Forums

Cerebral_009

12-01-05, 04:21 PM

It's clear and well documented that the dragons have long taken a back seat in the affairs of the lesser races... well, most of them.

But after much questing in the world of Azeroth, and a good hard read of Shadows and Light, I'm beginning to wonder if we wont see more of the dragons in the coming years, and the coming conflicts that the years will surely bring.

We know that Malygos is sane again, and it seems that Alexstraza is making good on her pledge and helping him rebuild his descimated flight.

Before I go on, I'm well aware that the amount of Dragons in WoW is not an accurate reflection of draconic population, but we can't ignore the evidence, even considering the necessity of dragons in any good RPG...

I've seen many blacks.. mostly wee ones, and black whelplings seem to be the most frequent whelp-pet drops. There are very few 'big' blacks that I know of, but I've only flown over Draco dar so far. Even from the air it appears that many of the blacks there are of the 'smaller' variety.. at least compared to Onyxia - who is likely one of the betrayers oldest consorts.

I've seen very few reds. There's *Narilazzazan* (god the reds have awkward names!) slowly flapping around the lower regions of the Alterac Mountains, a fairly large red, maybe 1/4 again the size of an average gryphon. I've kept a respectful distance from him - unlike my Kill on Sight policy with blacks (and my black whelp boots!) And there are a few reds around the Wetlands, too. None terribly large, by all accounts.

I've seen an abundance of Powerful Green Dragonspawn around Ashenvale's quieter and deadlier areas... and there's an abundance of whelps in the Swamp of sorrows on the eastern continent.

So far that's it, but it's enough to justify this post and the question it presents... Are the dragons taking a more active part in world events? (and not just exploited by the production team)

And this gives me the perfect opportunity to rant about my draconic progress to date! I got an emerald whelping within an hour of being in the swap of sorrows. The rarest pet-drop in the game, around a 1/1000 drop chance, and I got it within an hour... The dreamer truly smiles upon me! And for a rogue, I can do some quite interesting things... My Green Whelp armor randomly puts attackers to sleep, and I can create the same effect at will with a special dust, unknown to most players. Hehe, a rogue that can cast sleep is just too cool. Not to mention my poisons that I'm so fond of, especially mind numbing. I really pwn casters, especially shadow based ones.... they really don't have much of a chance at all! O.k, done. sorry, had to do that...

:g-shake:

Inquisistor7

12-01-05, 04:31 PM

Cerebral_009

12-01-05, 04:38 PM

Well, Onyxia certainly took part in world events, but I would hardly say that dragons' being alive and flying around constitutes taking a "greater" part in world events. I suppose one could say that the aspects' not blessing Teldrassil means they are taking a more prominent trole, but does no doing something mean one is "taking" part? I would think not.
True, but you gotta wonder why they're all flapping around... When they weren;t before. Like why are all those green in the swamp of sorrows? What -are- the blacks really up to now, and where are all the reds?

Maybe im just a suspicoius, and desperate, dragon lover...

=)

rudynoname

12-01-05, 04:40 PM

well they most likely would be. after the aspects were restored in DotD they seem to begin to come out of their hiding places a little more (ot nessesarly themselves physicaly thou). though they were absent during the third war so while they may be a little less shy they are far from taking an active role. well the aspects at least onyxia has taken quite an active role already.

onyxia is deathwings daughter, not his consort. at least i hope not. and while she is fully grown she is actualy quite small for a dragon. you also have red dragon spawn around grim batol. etc... I'd say they are becoming more active but still remaining in the background for the most part.

Inquisistor7

12-01-05, 04:44 PM

Cerebral: I think you are overly suspicious. So dragons are out and about in the world? That on its own proves nothing other than that they must have though it time to get some sun.

Kingcrazygenius

12-01-05, 06:54 PM

onyxia is deathwings daughter, not his consort. at least i hope not. and while she is fully grown she is actualy quite small for a dragon. you also have red dragon spawn around grim batol. etc... I'd say they are becoming more active but still remaining in the background for the most part.

Speaking of size, are there any definate demensions to the dragons? I remember in Day of the Dragon Deathwing was said to be twice the size as Korialstrasz.

Is it me, or does no one really care about the bronze dragons? You never see anyone talking about how they like Nozdormu best.

rudynoname

12-01-05, 07:36 PM

i do. nordormu is my favorite of the aspects

Diskordjah

12-01-05, 08:03 PM

oh yes man, the dragons are definately up to something! wouldnt be surprised if itll be the biggest thing since the demonic invasion either.
short summary:

Black Dragonflight:

we know that Onyxia has not only infiltrated stormwind, but holds real influence there: the boy-king and his guardian is under her control. since her arrival, the stormwind armies are bogged down, allowing various anti-government forces cripple the kingdom. one of said forces are the Defias, who worked together with the naga to kidnap the real king. blackrock spire is inhabited by the Blackrock Clan, foresttrolls still allied to them, and black dragonkin. we know that theyre all controlled by a dragon called Nefarion, or something of the like. in dustwallow march, the Stonemaul ogres who are loyal to the Horde were driven from their homes. Onyxias lair was their next door neighboor, but likely there was some greater thought behind the destruction.

Green Dragonflight:

Sighted in Ashenvale and Swamp of Sorrows most obviously, I suspect at least 2 agents in humanoid forms. In the swamp they guard the (sunken) temple of Atal'hakkar, who is either an old god or a powerful demon. makes sense, I suppose. however, elsewhere in the swamp we find whelps and other small dragons. near these dragons we find an elf named Itharius (or something, damn elven namnes). he's friendly to all, and upon meeting him he says, in quite elaborate language:

"greeting, you've come far off the beaten path to see me; this indicates that you have a special reason to do so?"
"whats an elf like you doing in a cave like this?"
"while it is a good question, it also indicates your lack of knowledge"

green whelps + mysterious elf = not coincidence

I am unclear of the green presence in ashenvale though. oh, I almost forgot my other suspected green dragon: a vendor in stormwinds magequarter, which could make sense: spying on the enemy in the Keep.

Blue Dragonflight:

all right, Malygos is sane. woo. however, the only confirmed thing I know about the Blues are that they help you defeat Onyxia; their matriarch in WInterspring (probably not cobaltann!) tells you how to create a key that will let you enter Onyxia's lair.

Bronze Dragonflight

dont know much here, only that one of them has assumed the form of a gnome and is fighting temporal parasites in the plaguelands.

Red Dragonflight:

Dont know much about them either, only that they seem to guard something in Grim Batol, which is quite, quite omenous...

EDIT: and that Narillasansz is one mean mofo. very, very scary to hear the roar of dragonswings when you are fighting a cat...

Inquisistor7

12-01-05, 08:13 PM

Disko, as interesting as all that information is, I'd hardly say that it amounts to something on the same level of importance as the Demnic Invasion. I mena, clearly some dragons are taking a larger role, but so far they seem to be in the background. Doens't mean they're unimportant, just that they aren't doing anything especially visible.

WarDragon

12-01-05, 09:25 PM

Personally, I think this is wonderful news. :g grin: Even if the Dragonflights are staying behind the scenes (the major figures, anyway), it seems there's at least strong evidence their populations are recovering.

About Onyxia: given the decimation of draconic populations (and similar circumstances in other fantasy worlds), it's entirely possible that she was in fact, both his daughter and consort. And where are you getting that she's "fairly small for a dragon?" I was under the impression she was one of the more powerful blacks remaining...

So, Malygos is not only sane again, but working actively against the Blacks? Good to know.

One more thing; Cerebral, are you saying that players can get Dragon Whelps as pets? :g shock: That would kick so much ass!

rudynoname

12-01-05, 10:50 PM

dragon whelps as non combative pets. just for show basicly.

and Nefarion is the son of deathwing, onyxias brother. Now Onyxia is one of the most powerful Blackdragons around, and as for her age, well its all relative. however she is a bit on the small side when it comes to size. if you read the raid article on the official site that had her as an example of and end game raid in there it states she is actualy small for a dragon. not to say she is any less powerful or anyhting. i'd give you a link but the site is down right now...and yea she could be his consort, i just have a hangup about draconic incest.....but yea it vey well may be she was or used to be or sumthing.....

but yea this is all stuff in the background. they are guarding secrets, being secretive etc.... they arent exactly acting out. still good to hear they are at least stretching those old bones of theirs.

Kingcrazygenius

12-01-05, 11:00 PM

Well there are only so many black dragons, but considering Neltherion is no where to be found Nefarion is possibly an even more likely canidate for a father.

rudynoname

12-01-05, 11:02 PM

oh great. more draconic incest....

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/misc/insider/020/interview.html

heres the info on onyxia.

Rowan Seven

13-01-05, 01:01 AM

Out of curiosity, does anyone here know how dragon reproduction works? I had the impression that only the Aspects can sire children and that they need special consorts to either provide the eggs or father the offspring, hence why the blue and black flights seemed to be in such dire straights earlier. However, with all these apparently new and young dragons showing up, this hypothesis doesn't make as much sense.

By the way, thank you Rudynoname for the information on Onyxia. That clears up much of my confusion over who is actually in control of the Black Dragonflight in Azeroth (the kingdom).

Kingcrazygenius

13-01-05, 09:43 AM

It would be rather rediculous if it took an Aspect to produce offspring. Dragons breed as dragons do, aspects included. The only difference between the aspects and ordinary dragons is that being virtually immortal they've been making eggs for an eon or two.

I just thought of something; if draconic incest was occuring in the Black Dragonflight than Deathwing wouldn't have attempted to steal Alexstrasza's eggs so as to hatch a fertile female. As with other flights, it is a safe bet that there are one or two male black dragons out there who aren't spawn of Deathwing (that's probably about it though). After all, Saphirron was just a servent of Malygos, not a son.

Diskordjah

13-01-05, 08:03 PM

I visited grim batol today. the place is guarded by VERY strong dragonkin and draken, as in 56-60. Batol itself seems to lack an entrance, yet the presence of the dragonkin leads me to suspect that something heavy is going down there: either a raid, or an endgame dungeon.

Diskordjah

15-01-05, 10:45 AM

found what is likely the entrance to the emerald dream today. took screens. anyone know where to upload?

rudynoname

15-01-05, 02:12 PM

Lord Kil'jaeden

15-01-05, 03:50 PM

@Diskordjah

http://www.imageshack.us (http://www.imageshack.us)
Fast, solid host, no need of registering and allow external linking.

Diskordjah

16-01-05, 05:23 AM

did u go in far enough to grim batol to reveal the map. entrance appears to be on south side.

oh and we ran into the caverns of time yesterday. a guild mate called me over to look at a elite dragon. i asked him what color and as soon as he said orange (haha) i rushed right over. we couldn't take him thouggh. buit it was nice to be close.

which dragons was it? Chronalis? Tick? we took em both down a few days ago! it was the third one that wiped us out =/

I went all the way to the entrance of GB, through the dragonmaw gates.

Grim Batol 1:
http://img117.exs.cx/img117/7952/grimbatol8ow.jpg

Grim Batol 2:
http://img117.exs.cx/img117/971/grimbatol23rn.jpg

the entrance, with a certain undead warrior who sacrificed his existance (and 25% durability) to bring you this picture lying dead from Dreamtracker the drake.
http://img117.exs.cx/img117/379/edenter6bo.jpg

Seradane, some sort of world tree? the dream tree? bigass tree anyway.
http://img117.exs.cx/img117/2065/seradane5ls.jpg
http://img117.exs.cx/img117/5372/seradanedistance6yo.jpg

and Kynaratholis striking a heroic pose outside Scholomance:
http://img117.exs.cx/img117/5483/scholomance4ph.jpg

yes yes, not very heroic since the steed covers him, but at least its a pic from outside the necro school at caer darrow, right?

Cerebral_009

16-01-05, 08:07 AM

which dragons was it? Chronalis? Tick? we took em both down a few days ago! it was the third one that wiped us out =/

I went all the way to the entrance of GB, through the dragonmaw gates.

Grim Batol 1:
http://img117.exs.cx/img117/7952/grimbatol8ow.jpg

Grim Batol 2:
http://img117.exs.cx/img117/971/grimbatol23rn.jpg

the entrance, with a certain undead warrior who sacrificed his existance (and 25% durability) to bring you this picture lying dead from Dreamtracker the drake.
http://img117.exs.cx/img117/379/edenter6bo.jpg

Seradane, some sort of world tree? the dream tree? bigass tree anyway.
http://img117.exs.cx/img117/2065/seradane5ls.jpg
http://img117.exs.cx/img117/5372/seradanedistance6yo.jpg

and Kynaratholis striking a heroic pose outside Scholomance:
http://img117.exs.cx/img117/5483/scholomance4ph.jpg

yes yes, not very heroic since the steed covers him, but at least its a pic from outside the necro school at caer darrow, right?
Interesting.... very interesting! But disko', and forgive my ignorance, how the hell do I take screen shots?

I can tel Wardragon is desperate for a glimpse of some red drakes, and I', up in the hinterlands just now - I quite fancy snapping Narilliansz.

But you are quite right on the green front: Charys Yserian, an arcane goods vendor in SW, most certainly has the feel of a green in disguise. Aside from the name, the fact that she sells arcane goods/memerobilia, she is dressed entirely in green...and I'm sure 'Whelpy' acts funny around her.... => But Itharius in the SoS confuses me.... he definatley isn't an elf, despite apearences, but he's just a bit too.... green!?! I dunno, I quess all will become clear at a later date.

I'll post some dragon pix as soon as some one tells me how to take bloody screen shots!

Reign of Kalos

16-01-05, 08:20 AM

Interesting.... very interesting! But disko', and forgive my ignorance, how the hell do I take screen shots?

I can tel Wardragon is desperate for a glimpse of some red drakes, and I', up in the hinterlands just now - I quite fancy snapping Narilliansz.

I'll post some dragon pix as soon as some one tells me how to take bloody screen shots!Well on my XP machine I press "print screen" and it's automatically sent to a TGA file in a 'Screenshots' folder in the main WoW directory. As you're using a mac, I'm not sure if you have a button that does that. You could try checking the keyboard options, to see if it's been assigned to another, or assign it to one yourself.

I also want to see some Red Drakes, I only got to see pitiful black whelps, which I took to hunting down for thier hides!

Diskordjah

16-01-05, 10:50 AM

as soon as I find what I want on the 'net (incidentally, its hard to find pictures of catholic priests!), I will go get Narillasansz and get a screen.

as for shots, you're on your own there Cerebral, damn mac-user you are... hell, maybe I'll finish my dragonhunt tonight and get some screens of Hematus and Blacklash, the twin liutenants of Deathwing.

Cerebral_009

16-01-05, 02:49 PM

Hey, disko' - stealing my thunder!

I'll get Nar' - im heading there after i've eaten. I'll snap the green agents, too. You get the blacks. My lv 44 rogue would be swiftly barbequed by those boys!

Oh and it's f13 for mac screenies - which this keyboard doesn't have. But my other does so I'll make do.

WarDragon

16-01-05, 02:53 PM

Cerebral, Disko; no need to argue! The more dragon screenshots, the merrier!

Cerebral_009

16-01-05, 04:52 PM

Okay dokey, Dana', these are for you...

Bugger it, it'll take too long to do a nice wee linked story, so I'll just randomly link them.

Dragon Watching in the Uplands of the Alterac Mountains: Dreamreaver and Whelpy encounter Narillasnz - and get a little too close at one point!

And isn't whelpy soooo cute!

:g laugh:

I think I'll go and grab some more shots of greens now... and I'll make it all the more dreamy by using my elixrs of Dream Vision!

http://img151.exs.cx/img151/3198/screenshot0116052120392mc.jpg

http://img151.exs.cx/img151/3998/screenshot0116052121269wv.jpg

http://img151.exs.cx/img151/7974/screenshot0116052122103xr.jpg

http://img151.exs.cx/img151/4818/screenshot0116052122350ao.jpg

http://img151.exs.cx/img151/6784/screenshot0116052123052pj.jpg

http://img151.exs.cx/img151/8746/screenshot0116052123488rg.jpg

WarDragon

16-01-05, 07:11 PM

Excellent, excellent. Cerebral, you rock! :y-thumbsu I take it Narillisanz isn't hostile if approached peaceably?

And isn't whelpy soooo cute!
Indeed; a right fine little wyrmling you got there!

Lord Kil'jaeden

16-01-05, 08:09 PM

A long time ago , in the first lore thread, i linked a picture i found of a cavern.
This cavern was populated with some Orcs NPC .

And in the middle of those hostile Orcs NPC there was a special small hostile black Dragon whelp named Singe .
No, not the Singe of the old Arcade coin op Dragon's Lair , but Singe as Grom Hellscream's pet dragon (http://img144.exs.cx/img144/5236/craft030sc.jpg).
And he was killable apparently.

I don't remember the location of this cavern , but i noticed that since all that time i saw no more references in text or screenshots to that dragon whelp.

So i wonder if one of you with the retail game found Singe in it or if it has been removed since the beta ?

yunn

16-01-05, 09:07 PM

Hellscream has a pet dragon?? Neat!

Cerebral: "Whelpy" is just SOOO darned cute... perhaps it deserves a better name than just... "Whelpy"...

Cerebral_009

16-01-05, 09:49 PM

Whelpy takes your praise to heart. =)

Err no, Narillisanz is quite hostile... I just got close in stealth - and you'd find it difficult to get a better stealth than mine. =>

Singe is now the pet of some Blackrocks who are hold out in stone watch keep in the the Redridge mountains. The blackrocks are under the sway of Nefarion, and seem to almost worship or reveer blacks - these guys in the keep are one of the few blackrock 'outposts'. But I killed singe, as I kill all other blacks on site.

I've got green dragon pics, but it's nearly 3am and I just got humilated by being crited by a troll rogue alost half my level in a two man pvp raid. I feel crappy. Vengeance was had, but still...

I'll post the others tomorro before work.

peace.

EDIT: And Whelpy is his temporary name. When he comes of age (years after I'm dead and plant food) he will be given a draconic name at a comming of age ceremony. Maybe even by the dreamer herself....

... how's that for a cop out?!? :g wink:

Kingcrazygenius

16-01-05, 10:52 PM

I got a name for him right now.

Brunch.

Diskordjah

17-01-05, 06:54 PM

I killed Hematus and Blacklash! however, I forgot to take screens. doh.

Cerebral_009

18-01-05, 01:28 PM

O.k, sory for the delay, but here's the green-age I've snapped so far...

Charys Yserian is the 'Human' curios vendor in Stormwind - that's the only one of these shots that isn't in the swap of sorrows...

Itharius is the 'High Elf' in the cave in the Swamp of Sorrows, the large whelps are near his cave. The dragonspawn are on the other side of the swamp, gaurding the temple Disko' mentioned. Still unsure what's down there, other than an instance.

There are many other Green Dragon Spawn in Ashenvale... but I saw them in the Open Beta, and haven't been back to that location since. They travelled in threes, one large one flanked by two smaller ones. There are also lots of Faerie Dragon-esque beasties in Ashenvale and Feralas - there's even a quest to get a 'spriteling darter' as a pet... basically a tiny hatchling fearie dragon. I'm going to Ferallas next, so I'll be getting that soon enough - though Whelpy is still my baby!

Enjoy:

http://img42.exs.cx/img42/5695/screenshot0116052203478sh.jpg

http://img42.exs.cx/img42/197/screenshot0116052227422uu.jpg

http://img42.exs.cx/img42/8796/screenshot0116052229404ux.jpg

http://img42.exs.cx/img42/1756/screenshot0116052257489dp.jpg

http://img42.exs.cx/img42/8986/screenshot0116052300125cd.jpg

http://img42.exs.cx/img42/3708/screenshot0116052300378ap.jpg

Diskordjah

19-01-05, 02:52 PM

when I was going to sleep last night, a theory clicked into place. I now know why the dragonflights stir, and it is quite unsettling. This screen was taken outside the Uldum complex, an old base for the Titans.

http://img105.exs.cx/img105/9653/doom5kp.jpg

(unfortunately the implications of what I read next made me forget about screenshots)

the titans will return. this is, according to the thingamajig that told me, something they wont do casually, it is something they think long adn hard about doing before actually going through with. they do it when a world has been heavily upset.

that was what the thingie told me. what follows bellow is just my chilling theory:

the dragonflights were charged with guardianship over Azeroth, right? well, azeroth has gone to hell anyway: 2 times the legion has invaded. elementals are seeping back, even one of the great liutenants are present. some mortals are actively seeking to bring more of both demons and elementals into the world, as well as bringing pre-titan lifeforms back. also, the Scourge is a threat of global scale, initiated by demons even if they lost control of it. Neltharion went crazy and became Deathwing; the dragons, champions of life on azeroth, has turned into a threat to it. alien lifeforms in the forms of orcs, ogres and draenei have also turned up in Azeroth, at the price of weakening the fabric of reality (which is probably kinda naughty in the eyes of titans). whats up with silithids we cant even speculate yet.

when the titans return, I reckon they will bring order to Azeroth again, through the old fashioned way: the annihilation of all things, then "reseeding". what Ive seen of the scientific nature of titans in WoW makes this seem pretty plausible.

the reason the dragonflights' become so active as of late is that they KNOW this. some have first-hand experience with the Creators. theyre preparing for the titans return, likely with different views on it:

1) the Dragonqueen, being She of Life, is likely trying to set things straight throughout the world (Krasus is having agents deal with Hematus and Blacklash, for example) to convince the titans to spare Azerpth from a cleansing fire.

2) the blacks have recently acquired control of Stormwind, the greatest human bastion of strenght still in the world, and are ALSO working with the Blackrock orcs: Deathwing's brood are building an army to go against the very titans themselves. theyre crazy enough, so why not?

3) the green ones... are actually something of a wildcard to me (sorry Cerebral!). perhaps growing up with 4 older siblings have left me somewhat paranoid, but I can see a motive: the emerald Dream is what Azeroth would have been like without non-draconic influence on the world, correct? well, what if the Dreamer's brood are working to realise the dream? to prove themselves worthy to the titans and being the ONLY ones spared the great annihilation?

THUS I FORESEE:
next in the warcraft saga, the titans will return, the blacks will fight them and be defeated, the mortal races will in some way "prove" that theyre worthy of continued existence to the titan bigboss. of course, there will be some scheming, devious titan somewhere that is using azeroth as a pawn to gain influence in the pantheon at the cost of every soul on the face of the world.

has my ramblings convinced yall yet? yes? no? then Im goin to the party.

Rowan Seven

19-01-05, 03:27 PM

A Green Dragon (http://img73.exs.cx/img73/2820/17greendragon0pi.jpg)

Gee, I wonder where this leads... (http://img90.exs.cx/img90/1184/17raidportalgreendragon3ri.jpg)

Thanks to ImageShack for Free Image Hosting (http://www.imageshack.us)

I apologize for the low quality of these screenshots. I contemplated returning to take new ones, but at level 31 the green dragonspawn in the area could kill me with one strike, and I don't think I'm up for a rematch quite yet. The portal in the second screenshot didn't send me anywhere, but I now know that its green color probably indicates that it's a raid portal and won't send players anywhere until the dragon guarding it is defeated. Oh, and Bough Shadow can be found in the northeast corner of Ashenvale with some searching.

*reads Diskordjah's post*

Interesting. Very, very interesting. Looks like the citizens of Azeroth might want to start investigating the possibility of a mass exodus to Outland. :g laugh:

Diskordjah

19-01-05, 03:54 PM

Cerebral_009

19-01-05, 04:48 PM

while you are correct in that green portals are "raid" portals, the vortex YOU found wasnt one of those - the swirliness was too dense. naw, that thingie, I suspect, leads to the emerald dream or something of the like.
And It's my personal obligation to investigate exactly where that portal leads - one way or another...

Regarding the greens - for all their differences, they're more like the reds than many realize. Their inherent and intrinsic love for nature - the fact that they are themselves part of nature and the very fabric of the world - likely means that they'd be working with the reds, and not so selfishly. They are likely trying to find mortal connections to the Nightmare in the Emerald Dream - and they'll probably need the help of wiling - high level - adventurers to do it and help fix it. I suspect Itharius is a quest giver connected to the Emerald Dream.

Regarding Disko's theory... urrrgh. It's just a bit too -plausible. So much so, it scares me. It explain all the activities of the dragons all too well. And yeah... I've been doing a bit of work regarding the titans, too - very methodical, self critical, contentious bunch. Scary.

That theory doesn't take the Naga into account, though? They'll have a hand to play - and not a bluff. They're definitely up to stuff...

Diskordjah

19-01-05, 07:27 PM

the naga? what about the naga?

WarDragon

19-01-05, 07:54 PM

I'm with Cerebral; that scenario is pretty scary, Disko, not least because it makes so dang much sense. As for the Naga, I'd just add them to the list of "defects" the Titans plan to "correct." Azshara's powerful, but nowhere near their level.

Unless of course, she gets her slimy tentacles on Norgannon's Disks...

Kingcrazygenius

19-01-05, 10:26 PM

Azshara can more than hold her own against all but the Pantheon.

Rowan Seven

19-01-05, 10:41 PM

Azshara can more than hold her own against all but the Pantheon.

*cough*OldGods*cough*Kil'jaedenandtheBurningLegion *cough*

Lord Kil'jaeden

19-01-05, 10:58 PM

The "return of the Titan" revelation is interesting, but in my opinion an event of this importance , looking at the level of power of such beings, will not occur before Warcraft 4 (if as i think Warcraft 4 background will revolve around the Old Gods).

I think there will be the defeat of the Lich King before that, certainly in WoW expansion endgame content, as it will serve no more purpose when the Old Gods will rise from their prisons.

Cerebral_009

20-01-05, 08:31 AM

http://img159.exs.cx/img159/7086/screenshot0119052043573fr.jpg

http://img159.exs.cx/img159/8017/screenshot0119052221195rp.jpg

http://img159.exs.cx/img159/8168/screenshot0119052235501el.jpg

The area that Rowan Seven posted, Bough Shadow, contains the largest population of powerful greens I've seen - so It'd be no surprise that the portal does indeed lead to the Emerald Dream. Two level 62 -big- dragons, Phantim & Dreamstalker, and 5 troups of equally powerful spawn: Emeraldon Oracles, Treewarders and Bough Gaurds. The portal is inaccessible - it's not a raid portal, confirming my suspicion that it is quest activated. And an end game quest, at that.

Below are shots of the Flamemane Blacks in the Dustwallow Marsh - confirming that the blacks seem to have ome vendeta against the humans. The blacks have destroyed a very powerful Stonemaul Ogre encampment, and have set partrols in there. It seems the marsh is a point of black power and influence, and I pitty Jaina and the Lorderon survivers if Emberstrife decides to strike.

I must admit, at first glance I thought these dragons (spawn and whelps) were red - even the names would fit red minions, but closeer inspection confirmed them as blacks. I have a theory though, and the emberstrife's name adds weight to the throry: We know that the blacks, for a long time, were hunted and had a poor population.. yet they seem to be on the increase... Isn't it quite possible that a black to take a red as an unwilling mate - produing 'strife' ridden and confused offspring?

For interests sake, the areas of dustwallow that these dragons are found: Dragonmurk and Wyrm Bog, have been scorched to nothingness - charred, burrned and descimated.. but the area lacks lava, mountains, and brimstone - and it seems all the other blacks, we know love alll that stuff, choose to make thier homs on or in it - unlike Emberstrife who secludes herself in a cold, wet cave....

http://img134.exs.cx/img134/5482/screenshot0118052105029gh.jpg

http://img134.exs.cx/img134/4011/screenshot0118052106073ut.jpg

http://img134.exs.cx/img134/8793/screenshot0118052123466cn.jpg

Kingcrazygenius

20-01-05, 11:19 AM

Well you gotta find mates somewhere don't you? And Reds are probably very fertile.

Diskordjah

20-01-05, 01:49 PM

Itharius is confirmed as a Green Dragon. there is one drake called Eranikus that, when he fell, lost his spirit to Hakkar. a small bit was left untainted though, and Itharius sends you on a quest to redeem him for the Flight.

Romanov77

20-01-05, 02:17 PM

THUS I FORESEE:
next in the warcraft saga, the titans will return, the blacks will fight them and be defeated? then Im goin to the party.

Can Dragon compete with Titans in terms of powers??

Lord Kil'jaeden

20-01-05, 03:24 PM

Here are 2 beta screenshots of Green Dragons (so it can have changed in the retail product)
Dreamscythe (http://img119.exs.cx/img119/2484/dreamscythe1fi.jpg)
the Shade of Eranicus (http://img87.exs.cx/img87/4598/eranicus5yu.jpg)

And while it has been mentionned , the Avatar of Hakkar (http://img87.exs.cx/img87/5561/hakkar6jn.jpg)

On term of power i think the Aspect could be a match of a normal Titan, but not for anyone of the Titan Pantheon.
If Titans are back in the future warcraft events , the only possible logical match can be the Old Gods (but only with some help in my opinion).

Kingcrazygenius

20-01-05, 03:34 PM

Can Dragon compete with Titans in terms of powers??

The forces of Azeroth have a chance against the Titans. The Pantheon on the other hand...ehehehehe...

CanadianGuy

20-01-05, 03:54 PM

Can Dragon compete with Titans in terms of powers??
It is my theory that because the dragons were given the task of keeping this world safe, they were probably given some of the titans power themselves.
Still it would probably take EVERY SINGLE dragon in the world to defeat one titan, and that was before all the years of coruption and death from all the wars.

As for the titans coming back in the first place, I'm not so sure. Sure they will probably come back, but not too soon.
So far both invations have been stopped, the second did more damage but still got stopped. The possability of a third is there but hasn't been put into action yet :y-huh: . The "intruders" came from another world that was created by the titans and have found more peace than the ones that stayed, so the titans probably don't care too much. The scourge is a problem and so are the old gods but there are plenty of foes for the scourge to defeat before it gains control over the world anyway (I don't know about the elementals or the Old Gods tho :y-mm: ).
Anyway the titans have a whole universe to build and rebuild and azeroth isn't in the worse shape comepared to some others. Outland is a good example because:
a) it has very little population of anything
b) it is practically destroyed from wars and Ner'zuls 'atempt' of escaping anyway
c) there is practicaly no demonic influence anymore

I think that the titans will return but not until the Warcraft 4 expantion, or something like that, because blizzard has made enough storyline to finish WoW and a lot more.

But I don't have WoW and haven't even touched the Warcraft books so I'm mostly going on what I've heard in these forums. So don't blame me if you can think of a thousand reasons why I'm wrong :g-sick: .

Kingcrazygenius

20-01-05, 04:08 PM

Canadianguy, in my opinion you vastly overestimate the average titan. Granted, the Pantheon is pretty much unstoppably powerful but Azshara, Ner'zhul, and Ragnaros are all more than capable of flattening a run-of-the-mill kind of Titan.

Plus there is Elune, and she might not take kindly on Titans getting in on her business.

Also I should point out that not every world was ordered by the Titans. Draenor and it's native races could have easily enough come about on their own accord. After all even Azeroth already had gods and elementals around.

Lord Kil'jaeden

20-01-05, 05:54 PM

I always wondered , did Elune already existed when Azeroth was the realm of elemental evil under the the Old Gods rule ?
Or did she only appeared after the Titans banished the elemental and chained the Old Gods, then modified Azeroth to their idea of what is Good ?

So is she a direct creation of the Titans or an unexpected new born deity due to the power unleashed in the Azeroth ordering, or a deity that precede all the Titans work and potentially existence ?

Kingcrazygenius

20-01-05, 07:03 PM

I doubt Blizzard would have her more powerful than the titans if she were a creation of them. As to what she actually is...I've no idea.

Cerebral_009

20-01-05, 09:55 PM

I doubt Blizzard would have her more powerful than the titans if she were a creation of them. As to what she actually is...I've no idea.

Well my theory on elune is simple... and workable:

She is, essentially, and old god. Not an elemental being, because she is not an element of the planet - she is the moon, part of azeroth, yet seperate to it. I suspect that Elune has been around for as long as the old gods.. but only came to power after the ordering, after peace was given a chance.

Diskordjah

28-01-05, 05:36 AM

Cerebral_009

28-01-05, 06:45 AM

found another dragon (or drake) in disguise yesterday: Kalaran the Deceiver in searing gorge, who sends you on a multi step quest to set the dark iron watchtowers on fire to nullify their first line of defense. after you do so, he is nice enough to spare your life and leave you with some trinkets, including the "molt of the black dragonflight", whatever that is. then he triumphantly yells that "the legion of blackrock" will bitchslap the dwarves, or something like it.

also, near the Cauldron (dark iron stronghold) theres Twilights hammer cultists: one f them drops "the sign of ragnaros". could they and DI dwarves be allied then?
Makes sense if they are allied - The DIs have a pet Old God, and the Twilight's Hammer worship all old gods. Yeah.

I forgot to mention, that there is another seat of green power in the world, paralell to Bough Shadow in Ashanvale. Rothos and Dreamtracker gaurd yet another portal, identical to the one in Bough Shadow, with a nother contingent of hefty spawn gaurds. This 'seat of power' is in Seradane in the Hinterlands. There's also some glowing obelisks and a stone circle, so no doubt quest related for a later date.

Kingcrazygenius

28-01-05, 12:46 PM

Ragnaros is an elemental lord, not an old god. I would expect more from you Mr. 009.

Nephalim

28-01-05, 02:23 PM

Cerebral, you insufferable jackass, I am full of generic jealousy. I've been killing crimson/red/flamesnorting whelps in the Wetlands for going on two weeks in the hopes of finding a crimson whelpling.

I was hoping that I could eventually have all three, and give a red to my orc, a green to my ne druid, and a black to my warlock. However, I've sort of abandoned this plan, since finding a red one seems impossible. Did you find the green yourself? Or buy it from the AH?

Anyway, I would say that Ragnaros has a pet army of Dark Irons, not the other way around. He may be there against his will, but they would more likely do his bidding than he do theirs.

As for Elune, I hold that she is far too powerful to be an Old God. I used to believe she was one, as well, but she outshines even the most powerful of the Pantheon, and her anti-violence attitude (and powers) seem to knock her out of the running. I also think it a little simplistic to say that she IS the moon. I mean we know that there is cosmology so the moon could very well simply be a moon. Also according to S&L she nurtured life when the world was in its infancy. I think she's out of the running as a potential Old God, but we know so little about them, so anything's possible.

And just a friendly reminder to everyone, we have no reason to yet believe that the Old Gods themselves were tied to the elements. The elementals worshipped them because it was their powers that sustained the elementals in Azeroth, just like any mage summoning and sustaining an elemental, only to a much larger scale. The change in the prologue may be to reflect that one of the Old Gods was killed, not chained below the earth (the Master's Glaive). The elemental lords were their lieutenants, they were not the Old Gods themselves.

Cerebral_009

28-01-05, 04:17 PM

My shame is great, but mitigated in part by my error - That was meant to read "a pet of the old gods" - that's my story and I'm sticking to it. Furthermore, I did NOT inhale and I did not have sexual relations with that woman..... *coughs*

@Neph' - The Dreamer bestowed upon me the honor and gift of a whelpling within an hour. She obviously could not bear one of her agents slaying her children('s children) anylonger, and gave in. So yeah, a not-so-hard-earned drop was Whelpy.

Regarding Elune: An old god she may not be, but my point was simply that she is part of, yet seperate to the world of Azeroth. Intrinsicly linked, as any planet's moons are, but distant. Not saying that she is the actual moon, but the analogy is sound enough.

But I do know so very, very little about the Old Gods. Guess Im not alone there, though. Blizzard have yet to make it all up, I guess...

Diskordjah

29-01-05, 06:19 AM

I forgot to mention, that there is another seat of green power in the world, paralell to Bough Shadow in Ashanvale. Rothos and Dreamtracker gaurd yet another portal, identical to the one in Bough Shadow, with a nother contingent of hefty spawn gaurds. This 'seat of power' is in Seradane in the Hinterlands. There's also some glowing obelisks and a stone circle, so no doubt quest related for a later date.

would this be the same seradane I described and showed screens of on page 1 of this thread? :toothy:

Cerebral_009

05-02-05, 07:30 AM

O.K - additional information, clirifcation and a question.

Itharius is in the swap of sorrows for a reason: Yes, he's a green (no surprises). He's an emisary for Ysera herself - the Greens in the swamp serve two purposes - one is to keep watch over the Temple of Athal'Hakkar - a flying serpentine old god who spirit lies there (Lord KJ posted a screenie of that). Now, Eranikus, the biggest green and the biggest dragon ive seen to date, sleeps here in shade form - inside the temple. All we see is his 'Shade' form - he is in the dream and his powers alone are keeping the Swamp of Sorrows fertile, without him it would be a wasteland similar to the blasted lands. Unfortunately, due to his concentration on maintaining the natural flows, he and his flight (Including his two big gaurdians: Hazzas and Morphaz) have fallen into madness and nightmare - a nightmare nodoubt created by Hakkar by the proxy of his troll devout. Therefore I speculate that the Nightmare in the Dream in, perhaps, the result of the oldgods stirring.

So far I've found 3 'powerpoints' of green activity - all in verdant, yet troubled, areas of the world: Ashenvale - overlooking the Satyrs capital there. One in the Hinterlands, where the trolls there Worship Hakkar, and One in Ferallas, where Gorrundi Ogers play with shadow magic too much, and the Silithuds are on the march. Each of these powerpoints has a large tree connected by a portal to the emerald dream (as yet inaccessible to me) and is gaurded by patrols of powerful spawn and one or two big greens...

The question is this; once I've finished compiling my green knoweledge base, would anyone have any objections if I posted a thread here - saves me creating a webpage for what will be a relatively small ammount of data.

Kingcrazygenius

05-02-05, 12:02 PM

You greens are so full of yourselves. Think you're lords of the universe.

perfectgamer911

05-02-05, 03:45 PM

well if you think about Elune then you should consider Mother Earth too.

and for Ragnaros and the dark irons, read this: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/story/chapter2.html#18
the part of the war of the three hammers, Ragnaros enslaved them.

xShadowleavesx

05-02-05, 05:14 PM

Kingcrazygenius

05-02-05, 05:36 PM

If the titans are willing going to go and start using their powers, wouldn't they try to take out the legion? I realize Azeroth is special, but it's just one planet out of many, and the the legion could pose a threat to all of them. I would assume they would try to destroy the people undoing their work before they go about fixing crap.

Maybe they think what happened to Sargaras could happen to them. Or they don't want to chance making such a large portal for them to enter the Nether. Or any number of reasons why they wouldn't.

Diskordjah

06-02-05, 10:22 AM

for all we know, they might not be able to enter the nether. maybe they use Planck space instead or something.

anyway, I'm all in favour of posting a compilation of draconic lore here.
also, I have received a tip on where a fourth entrance point might be, one that makes sense: Duskwood, in the central, hard to access parts. rumour has it there is some sort of elven settlement there as well.

Cerebral_009

06-02-05, 05:59 PM

At this very moment im on a quest for the green dragon flight. We cleansed Eranikus tortured shade form, and now Itharius and I are gonna try and use a human medium in Winterspring to try and communicate with his half dead/half sleeping spirit form.

And disko, be assured Im heading there next!

Rowan Seven

11-02-05, 11:28 AM

IlidanStormrage and I found a dragon (probably red since he wore red robes) disguised as a human by the name of Belnistrasz in Razorfen Downs (which has been overrun by the Scourge) the other night. After 'freeing' him from his cell and returning the oathstone he hands you, he gives you a quest to guard him as he attempts to destroy an idol that the quilboar make sacrifices on. After five minutes of fending off several waves of quilboar and a boss, the idol shuts down and Belnistrasz disappears, leaving behind a flame with a message of thanks and a Dragonclaw Ring. I assume that he traveled to Razorfen Downs to investigate and observe the Scourge there and deliberately let himself be captured so as to be able to examine them more closely.

Lord Kil'jaeden

26-02-05, 01:20 AM

I noticed on blizzard WoW website, their future developpement page was displaying a Blue dragon : Azuregos (http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/underdev/images/azuregos.jpg) , found in the Aszhara area.

I wonder why the blues are target of attacks ? Aren't they supposed to be hiding to preserve their flight, as they are not a very lot anymore from what i understood ?
Or does the raid system of blizzard not following a storyline ?

Diskordjah

26-02-05, 05:11 AM

hmm, wasnt there a rogue pack of blue dragons in Winterspring lead by Cobaltann?

Cerebral_009

26-02-05, 06:40 PM

Yes - there are a few blues in winterspring. Ive only seen one named so far (not cobaltann but that is how the lore goes), but haven't explored as fully as I'd like. The blues there popluate the region known as Mathrozil... ancient NE ruins.

In Aszhara, there is already a contigient of sorcerous blue spawn in a lake region... This is likely where Azuregous will be spawned, and the screenie backs this up. We know that the blues are, as a flight, actively seeking sources of lore and powerful magic accross the world - their presence in the Highbourne ruins of Aszhara and Winterspring seems to confirm this.

@Lord KJ - no. Like almost all the named (non-black) dragons around, it's entirely player choice whether or not they choose to slay the dragons. The dragons are always easily avoided and, in the case of the more powerful ones, very well protected and isolated.

----------

Since I've hit lv 60, theres time to complete my research. Ill post the results here, and create my green specific thread later.

Grt490

04-03-05, 07:11 PM

I have received a tip on where a fourth entrance point might be, one that makes sense: Duskwood, in the central, hard to access parts. rumour has it there is some sort of elven settlement there as well.

There is a portal in Duskwood in the middle of the zone, but it has nothing around it, no dragons, no elves, no signs of it being used as anything. The portal is also unusable(by the undead at least) just like all of the others. If they do plan to use it as an entrence to the dream, it would probably open up to a town similair to the one in Moonglade, being populated by Tauren and Night Elf druids, as an opening area to get you started in the dream and a place to get and turn in quests.

Cerebral_009

06-03-05, 06:52 AM

There is a portal in Duskwood in the middle of the zone, but it has nothing around it, no dragons, no elves, no signs of it being used as anything. The portal is also unusable(by the undead at least) just like all of the others. If they do plan to use it as an entrence to the dream, it would probably open up to a town similair to the one in Moonglade, being populated by Tauren and Night Elf druids, as an opening area to get you started in the dream and a place to get and turn in quests.
According to my x-guildies, the portal in Twilight grove "leads to other worlds" they cited their source as the collectors edition dvd thingymebob.

I suspect that it will indeed lead to other worlds. But the three dragon gaurded versions of the same portal, Im certain will lead to the dream, and the dream only. Whether the one in twilight grove will or wont, I cant say. It is distinctly different from the 3 others, and is simply a Night Elven version of the same portal that exists in the Wizards Sanctum in the Mage Quarter in Stormwind.

I've got some days off this week - i'll make up a new post then with the most up to date info on the dragons that I have. To answers the question: YES! The dragons are most certainly stirring.

FirstBorneEldar

14-03-05, 06:17 PM

Well If they stirring I will play along Im beginning 2 hate all life (truly!)....

Humans can only this: Making War,Starting War, Killing each other, Manupilate others and they are sort off ego's and arogantic.....

We should get killed all or there should be an new World Order 1 that will kill us and leave none alive :y-sneaky:

exarchofulthwe

20-03-05, 04:53 PM

I don't know if it is of any interest anymore, but i found a green dragon, i havn't seen mentioned, called Somnus in Swamp of Sorrows. Just for your information... (i have a screenshot if you want to see.)

Cerebral_009

22-03-05, 08:06 PM

Hehe - a blessing and a curse.

Azurgos, the biggest and baddest Blue in the game, has landed with the biggest patch WoW has seen... and it's screwed up! So 60% or so of the realms have been off line since extended maintenance over 8 hours ago... so I aint experienced the wonderment as yet. Gives me the excuse to work on this thread I've been threatening... ;)

Rowan Seven

23-03-05, 02:37 PM

I think it's a testament to how much I enjoy "WoW" that, despite all the problems last night and the length of time it took me to log-in, I was still up past 4 o'clock in the morning playing the game. *whimpers*

Darkeggy

01-04-05, 01:30 PM

What about the Bronze Flight? Chromie's cool, but what are the rest of them up to? Like Nozdormu(sp?).

Lord Kil'jaeden

05-04-05, 04:29 PM

Some news about the Black Flight

-WARNING-
to avoid high level spoilers, i advice owners of the game World of Warcraft to NOT click on those links to see the linked screenshots.

After this post, i can't guarantee spoiler free replies from other users, consider yourself warned :)

Screen 1 (http://img37.exs.cx/img37/3348/onixia23ns.jpg)
Screen 2 (http://img85.exs.cx/img85/5739/onixia251ew.jpg)
Screen 3 (http://img85.exs.cx/img85/236/onixia35jz.jpg)

Nephalim

05-04-05, 11:51 PM

Kil, I don't think it that big a spoiler to reveal that Onyxia can die. I don't even consider this news.

Am I missing something from those screenshots?

xShadowleavesx

06-04-05, 09:40 AM

I love they way her head is displayed at the gate of the city. The mediveal touch.

Lord Kil'jaeden

06-04-05, 11:42 AM

Nephalim, the spoiler i wanted to make people avoid is not Onixia dead, as it has been revealed countless time, even on WoW official website
But th spoiler is that her death is a world changing event for high level characters, as her head will be then be a part of the decoration in the factions cities.

If someone look at those screenshots, he would have no more the surprise to found her head exposed to everyone when making a travel to those faction cities, that's the reason of the high level spoiler warning.

KelenTheSeeker

08-04-05, 09:07 AM

What happens with the Dragons and other high-level creatures (like Hakkar) or leaders of the races, such as Thrall, when they are killed? Is it a permanent death?
Or if I were to make a character for WoW tomorrow, would the Dragons, high-level creatures and race leaders be revived after they are killed by another player?

twisted orc

08-04-05, 12:06 PM

no, everything in the WoW universe respawn, even raids.

Lord Kil'jaeden

19-04-05, 08:00 AM

On an internet corner, i found this screenshot (http://img246.echo.cx/img246/8334/dfbdfbfbdghn2nn.jpg) without any explanations, it is one of the black dragon i never seen until now on the world of warcraft pictures i noticed.

From several parts of the body, it reminds me of Onyxia so it is possible that it is Nefarian her brother.

Someone can confirm if it is Nefarian or if it is another big black dragon (and so what would be the name of this one) ?
And where is that screenshot taken ?

Cerebral_009

19-04-05, 03:16 PM

EXCELLENT work, Lord KJ!!

Where did you find that... i am in awe!! =)

The architacture is, without a shadow of a doubt, Black Rock spire - confriming your theory that it is indeed the vile prodgeny of the dark one himself - Nefarian. Blackwing Lair (nefarian's lair) is to be the new raid dungeoun opening with the next patch. - this must surely be an exclusive beta screnshot!!

As a side note, I adore the way blizzard dev team have put much effort into the subtle, but powerful differences in the models used for the powerful dragons.... every one is different, appropriate to my view of them and their respective flights.

All round frelling fantastic!!!

My sicere thanks to you, Lork KJ - a fine birthday gift indeed =D